NYM: Perfect, for the interview for transcribing. First of all, thank you so much and
congratulations.
RC: Thank you.
NYM: Oh, you just froze.
RC: Now?
NYM: Uh, no, you are there, but you’re frozen.
RC: Ok, hold on.
NYM: Ah! Perfect, I saw movement.
RC: Oh, good now?
NYM: Um, no.
RC: That’s weird.
NYM: I can hear you ok, though.
RC: You can hear ok?
NYM: Uh-hm. Yup.
RC: But I’m frozen, so it’s probably a little distracting.
NYM: laughter A little bit.
RC: Um, do you want me to try on my phone? I don’t know why, how that could possibly work
better, but maybe, it’s a college internet thing, should I try that?
NYM: I don’t know, you’re working now, maybe it’s internet-
RC: Ok. So I’m not frozen now?
NYM: No, you keep, uh, switching in and out. But let’s go for it and see what happens. We’re not
gonna use the video, photo piece as much, but it is intermittent. Unless you want to zoom out
and chime back in with yourself.
RC: Let me, let me try that one time.
NYM: Yeah? Ok ok ok. Let me end this call. Ok. Is that better there?
RC: Ok let’s hope maybe this will be the trick?
NYM: Yeah, wow, it is. Yeah, that’s so strange right? It’s just the way of the world today. Have
you had a crazy day?
RC: I, yeah, it’s been like, it’s been back-to-back ‘cause the women’s program I run now, all my
students are in the interview phase of the matching process, so I’ve got like 30 students coming
in so, it’s crazy but it’s good stuff.
NYM: Awesome. And I’m just turning off my email because it keeps pinging, um, and I kind of
don’t want it to keep stopping between our conversation. And also, I apologize, I know that
between Elle and myself trying to figure out getting to you, and getting it organized, we kind of
hit a place where it landed so late… I want to thank you for kind of responding quickly, and
going, “I’m available, let’s do this.”
RC: Yeah, of course. It’s an honor.
NYM: Fantastic. Ok, excellent. And we’re all excited about the photoshoot, do you, have you,
confirmed your time spot?
RC: Yeah, I gave my time and I guess I’m just waiting for the confirmation of when we’re doing
it.
NYM: Ok. Ok, that sounds great. Sorry, I’ll just turn that off. Ok, I am gonna jump in with the first
question. So my first question is, in your opinion what qualities makes a Moves Mentor?
RC: I think someone that brings, like, a consistent commitment to their life’s work. And that
means, like, there’s times in our lives where things are difficult, and we’re stretched thin, but it’s
such, part of the core being of who we are. We can’t not be this. We can’t not care about the
young people we work with. We can’t not do the right thing, it’s just, I think that’s really what it is.
NYM: Yeah that’s a good question, good answer, and you’re absolutely right. You know, I mean
if we’re not changemakers then who are we? Right?
RC: Yeah.
NYM: You know, who are we in this world? What are we doing? The next question, how does
mentoring benefit the mentor? Career-wise, intellectually, spiritually, socially, and in any other
ways? This, to me, is such a relevant question.
RC: Well I, like, it’s endless, so I’m gonna try to think about the different ways. I would say first
and foremost, I always tell everybody, teaching is the highest form of learning. So, that’s really
what you’re doing when you’re mentoring others, like what lessons can I bring? What can I
teach? It’s like, putting that out there, you really become accountable for your own teachings.
Like I’m really, even with my children, it really started to click for me that you have to model. It’s
all about modeling that behavior. It’s not about saying it, but doing it.
NYM: Right, right.
RC: So I think what I’m telling students, where I think they should go with their lives, the things I
think they should do, and experience, I’m telling myself to do that. So I think what you get out of
a mentor is, being a mentor is just the highest form of accountability, um, I think again you get
tied to your personal mission and like, your life force, I’m the most powerful and wise when I’m
mentoring.
NYM: Right, right.
RC: like I’m in the flow, right? I always tell people, “Find your flow,” it’s like I’m in my highest self,
my highest wisdom. You know, we have rough times, you’re in that lizard brain, like other part of
your brain, but this job I’m always in my highest self, and I find that being a mentor to other
people I bring that to everybody else, it doesn’t burn me out, I want to go home and be my
highest self to my family, my partner, you know? So, I think that’s what mentoring has really
done for me.
NYM: Yeah, absolutely, and touché to that because I think you’re absolutely right, there is so
many layers of what you get out of what you give to somebody, and I think that the novelty is
the, what I always say, the selfish satisfaction, you’re gaining all the time from the knowledge of
this youth that now you experience differently because you’re older and wiser, right?
RC: Oh yeah, yeah. And it makes you say that you’re just really glad you’re not 21 anymore!
laughter Glad I’m turning 40 this year, I’ve learned a lot of lessons and it makes you excited to
learn and grow. It gives you empathy for the things that young people face, life is hard. We kinda
call out youth for all the things where they’re letting us down, but their life was quite hard, and it
reminds you to have empathy for that stage of life.
NYM: Yeah, it’s the truth. It’s the absolute truth, I think we forget sometimes that, I always, my
husband and I always talk and say that, you know, “But why is it that they don’t do what they did
when we were kids?” But the world is different today. They’re exposed to so much more than we
were ever, ever, ever exposed to. I can’t even remember ever having a computer or access to
any digital device when I was young.
RC: Oh yeah.
NYM: And the time that you did, you were so much older and you were in your workspace. You
know? The kids today are like sponges, they’re sucking all of that in. And how many parents do
you know where they say, “I walk up to my nieces, my grandchildren, and they say ‘Hey, I’ve got
a problem, can you fix this?’” laughter
RC: No, exactly! And I always laugh, but I’m like listen, the generations are always also too a
direct result of parenting, that popular parenting that went on, and listen we kinda view, like I
would view my parents’ parenting style that would be considered neglectful at this point, right?
NYM: Right.
RC: So maybe it was dangerous but you just developed qualities from the bad things, and I
think we’re at a place where we’re more emotionally-conscious parents I think, in general, not
everybody. But with that, maybe there isn’t some of that hardship. I just feel that with every–
they’re good at certain things, not bad at other things. Maybe they will find their identities earlier,
or you know, have more empathy for other people, and maybe they’ll make better choices. Like
they’ll make better choices, they’re not rushing into marriage, they’re not rushing into things, but
yeah, so I think it’s funny. I learn a lot from them, whether it’s like the popular trends– they got
me out of my skinny jeans and I was proud. I was like, “I gotta stop with the skinny jeans!” or
just, yeah, they teach me to constantly be more empathetic. Some of the students come in and I
could say, “Oh they seem so bitter or annoyed,” but they then could tell me how shy they are,
and how they’re not used to doing interviews or whatever. So I think it’s important to me to build
that empathy, a lot of what we think is happening is not what’s actually happening. It may be
fear, it’s discomfort, it may come off like they’re being resistant. I’ve just learned to open my
capacity for understanding other people through working and mentoring younger people.
NYM: Wonderful, I salute you in saying all of that. It’s probably what makes you an excellent,
excellent advocate and teacher. But moving on to the next question, which is really interesting in
what you talk about right now is, should mentorship be a company requirement or more of a
personal giveback? Because how do you make more people responsible if you don’t make it
almost mandatory?
RC: Oh gosh, this is a great question. I’m personally not a big fan of forced activity, mandated
activity. I think you have to create a lot of pockets of opportunity and education, so, like I’m
thinking about a college. Are you creating a lot of opportunities for senior leadership and
experienced people to be where the students are? You know, are you creating a situation where
all the club presidents maybe go to some networking forum constantly to meet people or
whatever? I’m much more a fan of making mentorship a climate and a mission focus of your
organization, rather than a mandated thing. Like I think even about the curriculum at my
daughter’s school that they do, I wouldn’t say it’s anti-bullying, it’s more proactive. Like respect
for others, ‘if you see this, do this,’ and I’m just more of a fan of embedding what the greater
mission is into it. So like, why do we mentor? Is it to, what is it, do you want to say that the goal
is to learn from others, extend a helping hand, be open-minded to people who aren’t like you?
I’m just much more of a fan like that. I think, again, we don’t want to say that ‘cause it’s harder,
it’s more amorphous. But I’ve learned that you can operationalize complex things; that’s literally
what I do everyday at my job, helping students get jobs but I’m also operationalizing the major
they pick, or why they want to do this. It’s possible, but I just think we need to be open to doing
things that you don’t come up with on a Friday and implement on Monday and say, “I wipe my
hands clean of this.” Like I’ve come up with a mentor program, everybody’s gotta do it, I check
that box.
NYM: Right.
RC: You have to think about culture.
NYM: Right, right, right, right.
RC: But I think it’s hard. It’s like, I recognize that it’s kind of a big picture, idealistic focus. I’ve
worked with students for twenty years, I don’t see, they don’t seem to gravitate towards the
mandated approach.
NYM: Ah. But I think, if you look, if you take the approach you’re taking, and then you take that
to corporations that feel, well, if we don’t have to do it, because this is time and resource that
could be spent in making money instead of actually coaching or enhancing the performance of
somebody ‘cause mentoring is almost sponsoring on peer-level. So there’s lots of ways that this
can be viewed as, if corporations don’t have to do it, then they won’t do it. Because there are
many corporations that this is their mindset you know? Which is unfortunate, but we have both
ends of the scale. And some people do it because they want to be seen doing the right thing,
but not necessarily advocates for the deliverables at the end of it and the successes because
well we do it. It’s like, oh my god, just took me to a comedian talking on the TV last night on
Netflix, and he’s saying, “Oh yeah, the first things companies want to do is say, ‘I’m
environmentally conscious’ or why don’t you just sell me a discounted item instead of being
environmentally conscious? You know?
RC: Yes.
NYM: So you use that as an excuse to say “I can charge you more prices.” laughter
RC: Just again, I think it goes against, we’re all, everybody’s in a scramble now more than ever
to produce, so I think that’s the struggle, I always think, I think you bring up a good point about
the mentorship vs. sponsorship, and to me, they’re two entirely different things. My sponsors,
I’m in a state of performance for them; my mentors, I’m trying to learn from them. The sponsors,
I’m like, “I have it all together! Who do you know? Help me out! I’m ready, Coach!” Whereas the
mentor, you know, I remember when I was at Barnard, we didn’t have that many alum features,
alum/student things, so I remember they were like, “I want you to create a mentor program.”
That’s when I remember– I created Barnard’s mentor program– and when I moved here to
become a director, I just wanted to move up, I loved Barnard but I just wanted to move up. So I
came here and became the director here, and I was like “You guys have a mentor program?”
and I was so excited. They have a really good one, just like Barnard did. But when I started
Barnard’s, I’m like, “We need a three-pronged approach based on what the alum is looking for,
what the mentor’s looking for. Something about them and the performative aspect, “Hey guys,
look at me! I have a lot to tell you.” And again, no judgment. Some people are like, “I just want to
impart my knowledge.” Some people are like, “I just want more Barnard students at my
company, or I just want a quick commitment.” So I had multiple ways for mentors to get plugged
in. Like there was the full-year mentor program, that was a certain type of person. There was
something I created called Careers and Coffee, where alums would just come and pretty much
just talk about how wonderful they are, and how to be them, that’s what they wanted and that’s
ok. You know?
NYM: Right.